As you may know, we had many delays and we were struggling to find a solution to this problem. Titan was preoccupied with personal matters for months. During that time I tried to keep my chin up and work on the game. Until I kind of cracked... I couldn't work alone while waiting for something to happen.
Titan kept promising me stuff but everything kept failing so I decided to take things in my own hands. We agreed that we should have a new programmer, at least for the level design. Titan's friend never made any levels and another guy we tried to hire was a fraud and stole some money from us, without delivering anything (he has scammed others too, his account was deleted shortly after).
I spent January looking around for other promising programmers. I found 4 and we decided to try one of them. The new programmer delivered a good looking level by the next day. Still though, it was 90% complete and it would need Titan to check it and place it into the game. It looked promising and I would love to hire even more programmers to finish the game sooner. Unfortunately, Titan was busy for almost 2 weeks and the programmer, waiting on Titan, wished to move on to other things. To me that meant that no matter how many programmers we have, Titan will always be the middle man which would mean further delays.
That brings us to last week. Titan convinced the programmer to work on our game some more. And he promised me that he can finish the Beta by Monday, which was yesterday (which is something I heard over 8 times since September). Right now I have no patience left and obviously this cannot go on like this for any longer. With the walls closing around me, I made a bold proposition to Titan: in my search for programmers, I found a company who is willing to take on the entire game. I can run things my self but Titan won't be able to program the game anymore. He will of course be around as a helping hand, whenever he can and we will use the Patreon money to pay them. Titan didn't like it of course, but he realizes that we don't have any other viable options. Sacrifices need to be made for the greater good.
So me and Titan made a bet. If by the end of February he doesn't deliver the new Beta and if he doesn't change somehow his life in order to be able to work on this game in a punctual manner, then we will give the programming aspect of the game to a company. So this is up to Titan now and the clock is ticking.
Either way, these are good news for the game itself. We found a company who can finish the game and we have the Patreon money to pay them. And it's a chain reaction: if the game is good and the Beta releases are often, then hopefully, more people will support us on Patreon. Then more content it will be made and the game will keep getting better!
Let's see how things goes, I hope things will be good in the end
ReplyDeleteGood luck! I just hope that the idea of the game doesn't change due to company taking over the programming side... Well, better if Titan can take things under control of course. ^^
ReplyDeleteThe company doesn't have a problem with the game's adult content. But there are things that may get out of hand. For example, the sex scenes so far are pretty normal or even funny looking. In some sex scenes though or even in some MoGi designs we have no control. For example, a guy from the OffBeatr days paid for Succubus to be pregnant and full of tattoos. This goes against the game's philosophy but we do have to comply with that guy's demand.
DeleteSo maybe, since that may sound extreme to some, the company would not like to be involved in this. That is just speculation of course, but there is always a way around that. If the game is done by them and they don't want to touch Succubus, then Titan may as well be able to program Succubus himself.
In any case, I will do my very best to see this game finished.
Glad to hear things are looking up-ish! I won't sugar coat it you guys, I did stop my patreon support because of how things were going, not that I didn't believe in you or anything. But now that things are beginning to look up I'm willing to put my full support back into you guys. I just hope that by next month it all comes together, we've waited for so long!
ReplyDeleteGo Team Erogi!
Yes, that's perfectly understandable. I know it's a chain reaction. If we do well, we get money and then we make more games and we are all happy. If we are do bad, then we fail and we are publicly humiliated, our names are ruined and we would feel worse than terrible, probably ashamed to announce another game ever again. So, failure is not an option, that's why I'm fighting with everything I got.
DeleteAnd to be honest, I'd rather draw and animate than deal with all that procedural crap. But in any case, this should end one way or another, soon.
3 messages so far, all containing the word "hope". We start sounding like a religious hentai group here! xD
ReplyDelete"Let's all pray to the Church of Ucogi, so that Veins and Titan can deliver a proper final product, sooner rather than later! Amen!"
We ain't needing hope at this point...
DeleteYou think about why you're here now... You can feel the time until the next beta getting smaller and smaller!
ReplyDeleteVeins! Titan! Stay determined!!
DeleteYou are our future!
That is exactly the point at which Breeding Season fell apart. Let's see if you can power through this. Given that I've payed for the beta access, I hope you make it.
ReplyDeleteThat is exactly the point at which Breeding Season fell apart. Let's see if this game survives. Given that I've invested into beta access I do hope so.
ReplyDeleteI'm trying anything I can think of to keep this project going. If anything, I'm sharing all this, in case any of you can think of anything that I haven't. We are running out of options but thankfully there is hope for a strong comeback.
DeleteVictor, you're doing so much better than the project that I backed with the most money, so I have more faith in you and your team to do what's right for the game and backers. Just make sure that the company you speak of is legit and won't cheat you like the previous person who didn't deliver.
ReplyDeleteBest of luck on the game and I will be looking forward to the next Beta, when it does come out.
Thanks, mjm. Your words mean a lot to me. They seem legit but so far it's hard to talk to them with the time difference and all. Bad luck I suppose but Me and Titan were waiting for them to talk to us for over 4 hours but the woman in charge had an emergency and left. It's like we are cursed...
DeleteI guess I have to wait some more now, for her to reply.
Have you ever read The Mythical Man-Month book? You probably should if you have not. You did so many typical mistakes in your project…
ReplyDeleteI briefly checked it on Wikipedia: "Adding manpower to a late software project makes it later".
DeleteI suspect it's just a hypothesis (sorry I don't have the time to read a whole book), but it probably does not truly apply to us. The way I see it, I was waiting for too long for progress to be made and I can't wait any longer. The alternative at this point would be to quit this project or hijack it (kinda like Breading Season's S-Purple) and make my own version of the game with new programmers. But I try to avoid this disaster from happening with everything I've got.
At this point I don't care about past mistakes. All I care is about viable solutions. And that company is our best chance of finishing the game at this point.
"Adding manpower to a late software project makes it later". This is true when that manpower is already doing some work, which isn't true in your case.
Deleteas long as i can get the game once its finally out il be happy since i am a offbeatr supporter. the only question is will i get the new stuff added from patreon goals?
ReplyDeleteYes the final product will contained everything from Offbeatr and patreon.
DeleteSo what happened today:
ReplyDeleteI was talking with Titan to that company woman about working on our game. Delay after delay, 4 days have passed and I still havent talked to her manager. She promised I will talk to him tomorrow.
So everything was smooth so far. We asked if they could do a test level to see how good and fast their work is. She accepted it yesterday but she refused it today because it's their policy not to work for free. Then we agreed to pay her for the test. She rejected that also, because they only work on big projects and they can't waste their time in one silly level.
So she wants to get paid 30% upfront without giving me any proof that they can actually develop the game. Her claim was that they are big and everyone trusts them and that we should believe her. Funny, how can I trust her if she can't even be on the meeting on time for 4 days straight?
I hope her manager will be more reasonable when i talk to him tomorrow.
Sounds like a scam. I'd research the company and see what people have said about it before paying them.
DeleteThat's... quite a bittersweet news...
ReplyDeleteYes... well, we do have a guy who made a level and he will do one more level soon. So there's some progress at least.
DeleteI also managed to talk to the company today and I emailed them everything we need to have in the game. I asked them again to do a test level. So I'm waiting for their reply. The whole company shares the same Skype so it's hard to know who is who when I talk to them. I try to seal the deal while being fair and careful. makes my head hurt.
Also Titan works on the current Beta.
"Whole company shares the same skype."
DeleteCombined with the woman's obviously dishonest behavior, this is a clear indication the company isn't legit. At best, they're "bigger" than you and Titan in terms of rep and team, but that could range by quite a margin. The project has gone 4 yrs with so little progress and despite your assurances that things are getting done, it's JUST NOW being revealed that very little has actually been done. I've played up to 1.19 via links on 420chan, and you have maybe 2 levels and 10 girls since starting the project.
I don't mean to demean you or anything, but the people "encouraging" you are the same bleeding-heart retards who would have contributed to Breeding Season and now S-Purple while telling themselves that it will succeed. Maybe S-Purple will finish the game. The point here is, your "loyal" fans that blindly praise and encourage are hurting you. The ones who are expressing a variety of negative feelings are the ones you need to listen to because they have something valuable to add. Any idiot with money can throw money at something. An intelligent man will scrutinize his investments and expect a return.
Finally, as impressive as your plans for this project were, you really should have just kept it to just a game and some patreon-exclusive input. A card game that nobody will play, merchandise you're probably never going to sell, and a game on top of it is too much for two people. You over-committed yourselves and seemed to have lost sight to where all the other stuff probably had an adverse effect the overall progress of the game. If this project can recover, it'll be another 2-5 yrs before you finish it. Project X remains unfinished after 5yrs+ of delays, in-fighting, etc and is supposedly free upon release. Their advantage over you is a community of people who were already fans of the source material, and even that is struggling to remain relevant.
I'm not saying all this to discourage you, but it seems like you're a bit too self-deluded from the (admittedly) impressive scope of this project and the empty praise of fans who probably think they're making the world a better place by demanding the rich pay for everything while having not even the faintest idea of how economics work.
The hard truth.
DeleteThis is mostly true and it pains me since I have done art that is almost 2 years old and I havent seen it in the game yet.
DeleteSo I'm glad there are people supporting us and i also like people who do constructive criticism. I know what is wrong and i haven't lost sight of what it needs to be done. The game however requires programing, otherwise the project would be finished a long time ago.
The card game was a side project. And I'm not sure about what merchandise you are talking about. But I'm still here trying to fix this.
The truth is we had a good demo and a promising start. It was a prolific project it just needed to have more of the same work to be completed. At the beginning we made 1 level but we needed 11 levels. It was something that could be done with devotion. Titan has the skills but in over 4 years lives change so now he doesn't have as much time to work on the project as when we first started the game.
If anything, the "praise" we get makes us both feel bad because we know we should have done better. And that's what we are still trying to do. What is happening here is something I foresaw 2 years ago and I warned Titan about it. But me doing graphics is not enough to push the game forward.
i have buy your game
Deleteif one day the game is finished, we will download the full game in our email (i hope)
Or it will come in box at home at home(i hope not^_^)
thx for your answer
Keep the link you got from your purchase. In that link you will find all the new betas we will release and the finished game once it's completed :)
Deleteso if we payed via offbeatr will we just forward the email we got from them that says our credit card has been charged?
DeleteWe have all the emails, so you don't have to do anything unless we forgot anything regarding offbeatr (like a pledge or something) and you need to prove who you are.
Deletealright thanks, keep up the good work
Deletei only payed for the game not the one with beta and full game when its out so when ever the game is done we will get a link by email right i dont check the blog that must since i didint pay for the beta, i do pop by to see if there anything new or not since there are other games im waiting to come out. so i hope we will not have to say something when its finally done to get the game since i dont check the blog everyday. if we have to say something i hope there wont be a time limit since i dont pop by everyday
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure if you can somehow subscribe to this blog and get notifications in your email or somehow follow us. I will surely post it in Ucogi's Tumblr and Ucogi account when the game is done, so you may want to follow those sites too. I'm not sure how Titan handles the emails we got from people who bought the beta but we may email them to know that the game is done. Other than that I'm not sure what else to suggest. If you cant do any of the above, you still dont have to check here everyday. You may as well check once per month. But to be honest, I dont think the game will be done for the next 6 months because there is so much still get done, even by me, and it will take me at least 6 months to have my part of the job done.
DeleteTitan lost the bet. I'm still trying to speed things up with the company.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteSad to hear about that news. although from what i've read in this comment section that even respectfully saying so, that company just sounds outright shady. what proof of legitimacy was provided to prove themselves to compensate for not even showing a promising output for a test level or even potential to further your project? even considering that fact that that woman you've spoken to forgets a company policy and remembers the next day, they defend themselves with a brittle claim of "they are big and everyone trusts them" who are the "everyone"? how much information is known of this "company"? it worries me to ponder the fact of a struggling project to get scammed in such a condition as it is currently.
ReplyDeleteI dont want to announce the name of the company because they may not want to be officially assosiated with an adult game but their site seems big and legit (I can however reveal images of the guy that scammed us). But just today the company agreed to to the test level. Titan will provide it when he can.
DeleteWell that's is a understandable reason to keep one's company name unrevealed. I recommend making a section of in which you may include the picture and information of the individual who has scammed you guys in the case that a viewer may take interest of asserting a consequence. In association to that, Has there been anything done to the individual who has scammed you guys?
DeleteI might release his info in our next post, after we have something to say regarding our deal with the company. No there is nothing to be done with the scammer. At least it wasnt a lot of money and we learn to be more careful from now on.
DeleteOf course getting scammed doesnt help the already gloomy situation that we are in. I'm still looking for some light to get us out of this horror.
I just paid the company a small amount for the test level. Let's see what they deliver. The discussion was a bit weird... It's been 2 months already since I started looking for a new programmer and things still work slow.
ReplyDeleteAlso we have another programmer that has finished 1 area and working on a 2nd area. He gets the job done but the game doesnt progress fast because everything has to go through Titan for tweaks and other details and Titan is not often around. But at least some small parallel progress is made.
I'd like to see one last "team exclusive" release before that company takes over a large part of the work and potentially redirects plans a bit. So may want to keep that race on, with Titan, as they may be able to get something done before the company does. A clean hand off.
ReplyDeleteTitan told me that he is very close to a new Beta but glitches keep appearing, mostly regarding the map. He has finished Turquoise, Bloodstone and Voms' sub weapons but he wants to release a solid Beta.
DeleteWhen the company takes over, we will still be in charge, so I'm not sure how they can redirect things. THe only thing I'm concerned about, is a MoGi that a pledger want to appear pregnant, and that might be a bit too much for some. If the company denies to do that, I'm sure that Titan can program her him self.
Well, it's the weekend and the company's dev team doesnt work now. The will keep me posted, so by Tuesday I should have news from them.
ReplyDeleteThe programmer we hired is still working on his 2nd level and I managed to pay him for his 1st level. We had a bit of trouble paying him through the site I found him from but maybe that story is for another day.
So since Titan lost the bet, how long would you say until we get another beta & how long will the gaps between each beta will be now that this company has taken over?
ReplyDeleteI assume that Titan lost the bet not only because he didnt had the time to fix the remaining glitches but also as a matter of principle. It goes without saying that Titan could have released a glitchy beta but he chose not to. Maybe it was too glitchy with the map and all. Titan wanted just "one more day" for several months now, but it was like chasing a rainbow.
ReplyDeleteI have no idea when a new beta will be released by the new company. One of the reasons they have to do the test level is to time how fast they work. Then they would have to fix the glitches and they should be able to deliver a playable new beta before creating any new content (in case Titan can't deliver the beta himself). I think giving them a month to deal with this, is plenty of time to prove that they know what they are doing. I'm anxious to play a new beta too. Having made graphics as old as 2 years ago and still not be able to see them in the game, is soul-crashing.
If the Company fails too, that would be very bad news. But as it may be obvious, I can partly control what they do and when they do it. I do have control of the game and I will supervise them but in the end it's up to them to do a good and quick job.
In my research for a new programmer I found a really expensive guy who does quality content. He is our plan B, a safety net of silk to land on, just in case everything else fails. He seems to know his stuff but his rate is like 3 times higher than everyone else.
But does your plan B know that this is an adult game & Is he ok with that?
DeleteYes he is fully aware.
Deletewhy does it feel like plan b should've been plan a
DeleteBecause it costs a lot more and 1 guy would be slower than a company with many more people working on it.
DeleteI still don't have any updates regarding the Company. They said they need a few more days to deal with the bugs of the test level. That's weird because I dont think it's easy to have bugs in a single area. I cant be sure because Titan is not around to ask him about these technical details.
ReplyDeleteThen they told me that a guy there will "take on our project on full priority from today", so it's like they hadnt started it as of yesterday. I wanted to seize this opportunity so I told them "if you can enchance the graphics in any way, feel free to do so. You mentioned that the graphics could be made to look more impresive, so if you can add lights or shaders or whatever, to make it look better, I'd like to be surprised by your skills."
Right now I'm revisiting the Tower which is the next level that we need to add. Looking at it with fresh eyes I realized that I need to add a few extra things. This would be a very complicated level to program but I'm excited about it because Voms faces a new Queen, cooperates with Chibi and it's a mind fuck of a level to design. Probably the most complex area in the game.
Regarding the Patreon rewards, please be patient. Titan deals with that and he is unavailable at the moment.
ReplyDeleteOk, Titan dealt with Patreon, you can all get your Rewards now :)
DeleteA bit late, but I just wanted to say thanks for the continual updates instead of keeping us in the dark.
ReplyDeleteAnd a big thanks to you too. With Titan not always around as he used to... the wait can be maddening when you wait alone. But I'm glad I got everyone's support here. It makes things a little better in my head.
DeleteThe Company told me that they will talk to me in detail tomorrow. Their QA department was testing the test level while the man in charge was making himself available. Apparently they will start working on the test level tomorrow.
In the main time, Titan gave a 3rd area to the independent programmer to built. He already made 2 levels, so there is some small progress at least.
A summary about my dealing with the Company that wants to take over the programming of MoGi Origins:
ReplyDeleteIt took a week to reach a deal and it's been 9 days today since we gave them the test level that it's supposed to take 2-3 hours to do. In total that's 15 days, half of a damn month...
There were the small excuses. The secretary had to go to a wedding, the manager's son went to the hospital, the manager got sick, and so on. Then they didn't want to do the test level, even though they previously agreed (I have no clue if the person who agreed what the same person who declined it because many there are sharing the same Skype). They denied they agreed and when I showed them the Skype conversation they didn't comment.
As days passed by, they agreed to the test but they assumed they will get paid for the whole project for some reason. They asked for a lot of money and I explained to them that only the test should be paid. That is the purpose of the test, to see if they can do it fast and efficiently, otherwise there can't be a deal. Also, they dont even know how big the game is or how long it will take them, how can they throw a price like that?
In any case, they got paid for the test level and I'm waiting for it for 9 days now. First they told me that they they have started with the project. Then they told me that they are looking for bugs (Titan assured me there are no bugs and the other programmer we are using was fine with the test level). Then, on Wednesday the manager told me that he dealt with his other projects (that he never mentioned before) and he will work exclusively on my project (he also told me that the "bug checking" is part of their procedure). On Thursday he promised that he will talk to me on Friday. On Friday he was nowhere to be found.
With all that, I messaged them today expressing my frustration. While I was writing this wall of text, they told me that the manager will have it ready in a few hours. Then, 2 minutes later, they told me that he doesnt work on weekends and he will get it done on Monday (so that's 11 days for a level that takes 2 hours). When I asked who is talking to me, it was someone I never talked to before, a Quality Analysis Manager (mr K).
When I asked him if he deals with my project or if he just talks to anyone who messages the company's skype, he replied that he is dealing with my project specifically (I think he should have told me that, when introducing himself. Actually I had to ask him for his name as well). Interestingly, mr K just came from vacations. He just saw the team testing our project, but when I asked him about specific details about the test he had to go and check. I dont know if I get paranoid but shouldn't he have an answer right away? Anyways, 15 minutes later he hasnt replied to me.
I'm very confused about these managers as well. Until now I was dealing with Mr J and now the manager's name is Mr K. So many managers and I still don't have the test level...
I find it funny how such a "big and successful" company who's worried to much about their reputation (as they mentioned many times over) makes such mistakes. But you know, it's not just the results that I'm waiting. I find it very irresponsible to let someone wait during the weekend without leaving a message, especially if you are a professional and you are a manager in a big-ass company.
Me: "any specific details about the test? any comments so far?"
DeleteMr K: "sure let me go and check. Just a moment please."
Mr K: (30 minutes later): "The testing is done okay now"
Me: "any details though? what did you test?"
2.5 hours later he hasn't replied. His only reply was so vague, it could be said for any test whatsoever. Fuck I'm so tired of people who waste my time and keep me waiting and they don't seem to care even when they get paid.
Yeah, like other have said, they're having you on. Cut ties with them completely and post their details on developer forums so others can avoid them.
DeleteJust a few more hours. They still havent contact me.
DeleteThey are scamming you. Asking for money for the whole project up front is extremely fishy and they're clearly doing everything they can to dodge your supervision. Ask them for a portfolio. Conduct your own research on them. If they are such a successful company, they have had some publicity.
ReplyDeleteGet their IP address through skype to look up where they are, compare that with where they say they are (just google how to do that).
Anyways, you're probably better off ditching them. You should try to get in contact with HentaiWriter, he supposedly is a gamedev IRL working incognito on h-games. He could probably give you tips or recommend devs if you explain your situation.
And your commet box is broken af. I've tried to submit this message 20 times now.
Thank you for your advice. I will check the ip but their skype is the same as their site so Im positive its them.
DeleteThe comment box its the same as in every other blog so Im not sure how that can be fixed. Personally I have no problem commenting here.
What the hell, man. Stop! The amount of time and money you are wasting on scammers and slackers is apalling!! Just pay the dude you said was expensive. You were kickstarted with plenty of money to pay for this, I am certain! Not to mention that you will get all your investment back once you sell your complete game
DeleteJust checked their IP like WurstKaese suggested, using resolvethem.com/. Their Skype IP points to Pakistan according to iplocation.net. Their site and Skype info says they are located in Illinois USA.
DeleteI have no idea what that means... I had spoken to Ms S. and Mr J. on the phone a week ago and both were speaking fluent English.
I'm at a loss right now. I will wait until the end of Monday for the Company's results. If they fail, I will cancel the deal with them and get in touch with the expensive dude. And I will post their details here because I had enough of this mess.
Good idea! Make sure to make a contract in writing and make him sign it.
DeleteThe Company not only failed to deliver the test level, they didn't even reply to my Skype messages today. No need to hide who they are... msglobalinc.net sucks. I may do a blogpost about the whole thing at a later day.
ReplyDeleteI contacted the expensive guy , Mr JP, and he will take on the project himself. All I need now is for Titan to talk to him about any technical details. And yes we will sign NDA and contracts n stuff.
Mr J. from msglobalinc contacted me 5 hours late (according to their timezone) and told me that "All the testing has been done. Just few bugs that we are fine to fix while the development is under progress"
DeleteI told him that I want to see the bugs report and receive the test level (I can't rely on them but I should take a look, after all we paid for it).
mr J: Ok, will get you the report on that shortly
Me: how long is "shortly"?
Mr J: Its just very early in the morning here. As soon as the software department arrives, will get you the update.
I'm not sure if he implied that they havent finished the level or not but obviously I have to wait some more. He also told me that the project was low on priority because the money we gave them was a small amount. Of course this is the first time I heard of that because on Thursday (5 days ago) they told me "From now your project is on priority as it was in the que"
I'm pretty sure that we won't be working with them because they dont deliver on time, they lie and they find excuses to stall the process.
Good decision to have ditched the company. Whether they are scammers or very unprofessional, it wasn't going to work.
ReplyDeleteMsglobal still hasnt contacted me. The good news is that titan talked to the expensive guy, mr. JR and he will be working with us. Also we will keep the guy who does the levels, mr AD.
DeleteFurthermore, Titan said he will release a new beta in a couple of days even if it has bugs. Cant wait to fight the chibis with the new weapons!
dude the company is in Illinois, feminism there is probably like Idaho to potatoes
ReplyDelete...ok. Got nothing to do with feminism, man. Victor, Good job on securing JR. Sorry I was harsh on you earlier...
DeleteIt has nothing to do with feminism since they agreed to develop the game. They knew of the content since day one.
DeleteYou are Anon so I don't know which Anon you were. But I didn't find any of the comments harsh. Sometimes we all need a wake up call or a second opinion. That is why I'm posting all these details here. First to justify why the project isn't moving and secondly because when you are in a desperate state you can't even trust your own judgement and you need to swap ideas and opinions in order to make good decisions.
In any case, the ordeal is over for now and we made a new post. Which is uplifting for a change :)
I'm sawy.
ReplyDelete